Curse

eA-Zaku · Jun 12, 2005, 12:00 AM // 00:00

Yeah, I don't get it.

By your thinking, as well, CtrlAltDel, a lvl 20 redoing missions with lower levels is cheating the game system. The Great Northern Wall was meant for low level players, and thus a level 20 running thet Wall is cheating the game system. Correct? Yet I hear no bitching about that.

CtrlAltDel · Jun 12, 2005, 12:08 AM // 00:08

because running the wall doesnt help you cheat out players in the PVP arenas, like running a character through to areas where hes not supposed to be

if you were supposed to have those skills and armor when you were a level 10 why not have them in ascalon

you are just trying to justify to yourself that it is ok to cheat and run low level players in the arenas

eA-Zaku · Jun 12, 2005, 12:10 AM // 00:10

Quote:

because running the wall doesnt help you cheat out players in the PVP arenas

And what are you cheating them out of? A good time with fair PvP'ing?

Well if we do things your way, we're cheating the Lornar runner out of fun because maybe he enjoys it?

M Dew · Jun 12, 2005, 12:13 AM // 00:13

It's definately not cheating.. period. There are no lvl caps on armor or gear (only skill reqiurements on certain stuff). WTF is wrong with you people. Get off your butts if you do not like it and figure out how to get the gear. If you want it bad enough. The only requirement to something like this is time. The creators of the game put in lornar's pass. And if this person has the means/time to get to Droknar's via Lornar's. Then they deserve it. Half of you all have probably never made it half way thru. It can be a very intense task to do and I seriously doubt the person just sat at the entrance and waited for an hour or 2 if not alot more to be pulled thru.

Give me a break. To me it sounds like you all want everything handed to you with out doing anything at all. Instead of using your brain and being creative. Have you all really thought about how much grief he went thru for his rewards. I don't condone cheating but there is definetly nothing wrong with this if he has the means/time to do it.

CtrlAltDel · Jun 12, 2005, 12:26 AM // 00:26

no they dont deserve it because joe lvl3 sits in beacons all freaking day and spams 'will pay BIG MONEY for 20s to run through lornars'

how is this fair to everyone else

if you havnt noticed the devs have been making patches to make this game even competitive for the casual gamer, not just the 12 year old kids here with no life that have 500+ hours on their characters

eA-Zaku · Jun 12, 2005, 12:40 AM // 00:40

I've heard so many people use the argument of "other player has more time, therefore the things he does which require time is unfair"

Yeah? Guess what? Get over it. It's not just this Lornar's "abuse" issue, but many other things. Someone with more time than you will also out-experience you in PvP from constant dueling. Are you then going to accuse him of having an unfair advantage? Because he has 500+ hours to get more dueling tips than you?

Dax · Jun 12, 2005, 12:43 AM // 00:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by CtrlAltDel

no they dont deserve it because joe lvl3 sits in beacons all freaking day and spams 'will pay BIG MONEY for 20s to run through lornars'

Have you ever considered exactly that- he sits all day and spams, it's the way he decides to play the game. Personally I find that boring I'd rather play, but to each thier own. I think any sort of powerleveling is pretty cheap, but since it's not against the rules and if they allow you to wear such and such armor that's a gameplay desision of the devs.

There will always be people in games that will find exploits

M Dew · Jun 12, 2005, 12:50 AM // 00:50

How many elites do you have. They are hard enough to get at lvl 20. now lets think about this.. ok.

You say this person is 12 years old. you also say he paid big money for this. You can prove niether. elites at lvl 20 are a pain in the butt to get now let alone before the patch lets take a look at the date this thread started.

6-05-2005. thats before the bloody patch that made it where you could get elites after the boss was dead. now lets assume this person is a lvl 10 since you say lvl 3 hitpoints would be even lower for that person with out a -60. I do not recall what exactly the average HP is for lvl 10 players so i am gonna say 250 give a take a few points. now this guy has managed to get to droknar's (via lornar's) with very inferior armor. I don't care if the rest where lvl 20's or not. This person was in a team that could only hold 6 people for something that some teams of 8 would struggle on at times. Now he has managed to get to draknor's and where ever this elite skill has to be captured... gonna do some looking real quick and see what zone its in.

Ok Ok I have just stumpled across something that even gonna make your guy's posty even more pointless. did anyone in this thread bother to look up where you get Ether Renewal. Im gonna leave it at that. make sure and well you look at the bloody elite skills section and learn where you ge that skill from. POINT AND CASE.

Assuming you know how a person did something is never a good way to present a post exspeacially like this. And if the poster and all the other people complaing would have taken the time to look at where that bloody skill comes from they would have not been so eager to jump this person. But since no one bothered to look at where this skill comes from it looks even more like a bunch of lazy whiners wanting stuff handed to them. sorry but seeing fictional arguments like this then having the pleasure of pointing out that in fact he did things the way you all say he should even makes you look worse.

eA-Zaku · Jun 12, 2005, 12:55 AM // 00:55

Strange. Ether Renewal is only available from Ascension missions. Yet this level 10 "abuser" has it?

M Dew · Jun 12, 2005, 12:59 AM // 00:59

um in other words he did not use lornar's. Got it??? YW

eA-Zaku · Jun 12, 2005, 01:00 AM // 01:00

Dude I got it. I was defending the guy, you know

M Dew · Jun 12, 2005, 01:02 AM // 01:02

oh sorry lol. got carried away i just get tired of people posting threads like this because they want the stuff handed to them. guess i should have paid closer atention to who i was reffering. so to you I am very sorry. And will be more carefull next time when posting.

Darc.Syde · Jun 12, 2005, 01:13 AM // 01:13

wel, there are alot of skils out there that can ignore armor. stuff like deep wound also make low lvls suffer.

Gildan · Jun 12, 2005, 01:30 AM // 01:30

... I'd still bet a pound to a penny (dollar to a cent for our colonial cousins) that he's an ex log-off ganker from EVE...

M Dew · Jun 12, 2005, 01:59 AM // 01:59

He could be lol.

Only a few people would be able to answer that.

I was just so quick to jump in on this thread because people were bashing the snot out of his reputation by calling him a cheater on the basis of assumption. And if he is not aware of this thread so that he could defend himself. Then the posters accusing him of cheating should have taken the care to do 5 minutes of research to figure out if in fact there assumptions had any ground to stand on.

I will say that the origional poster attempted to clearify that this was based on assumption by saying "He later confessed to having "top-notch" armor, armor I can only assume was from Draknor's Forge."

assumption can be a very bad and distructive thing. If not thought out.

Anyways...............

Aaaaagh · Jun 12, 2005, 02:54 AM // 02:54

If someone wants to put in all the work to get a newb to the desert/Draknors just to get good armor so he can pvp...well let him. Just remember that this player isnt using actuall skill. These type of players are really fun to play later on, because they get so (this was censored) 'full of themselves'. Inevitabally when you beat his arse into the ground at level 20 he will accuse you of cheating.

Mercury Angel · Jun 12, 2005, 04:32 AM // 04:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eclectic

I find your blase attitude about blatantly unfair advantage disturbing. First, are you the arbiter of what part of the game is "pointless" or not? Well, Mercury Angel says it's pointless, guess we should all go home. What arrogance. So, to recap, because it's pointless to you, we shouldn't do anything about a blatantly unfair advantage that at best uses a loophole in a competitive environment. Cheating is ok to you because you don't fight there. I don't post here much, I play the game more, but I keep hearing stuff like this (and frankly it makes me think you are one of the rushed-to-Droknar's people fighting in the arena, which you'll deny, and nobody will be able to prove one way or the other), where people basically condone something because it's done to someone else. When something doesn't effect you, we humans use something called empathy, where we imagine what things would be like if we were in their shoes. The lack of it I find so often is disturbing as well.

It's 'pointless' because there's no gain or loss from it. Obviously, the same goes for the entire game of guildwars, but the point should be obvious. You may run into the person and lose because of it, but you've lost nothing at all really. There're no penalties for it.

As for cheating, it's not. At best it's griefing.

As for a lack of empathy, I don't think you do too well in that department either

While it's unfortunate, there's absolutely nothing you can do about it, and it's perfectly within the rules. However, I imparted the reminder that not every battle will be like that, and that the people that do so won't stay within the level limit forever.

Quote:

Just enjoy the fights that aren't with such people, remember that while skill plays a major role in the game, obviously, equipment+skill advantage can be pretty impacting, and that your losses to such people aren't necessarily indicators in your lack skill. That, and they'll eventually level past the arena and get bored, and hopefully not be your problem anymore.

What part above is a hostile or professes a lack of caring?

I think the moment you read that I didn't agree with you, you decided I must be against you, and immediately felt all comments made were hostile remarks. Well, sorry, but the world isn't out to get you.

Take a step back and re-read, and reconsider.

You're getting all riled up about an issue that is merely a bonus to the game. Guild Wars is built and focused around 8 vs 8 combat, with all people at lvl 20, with everything appropriately scaled as such.

You're going to an arena that is 4 vs 4 and lvl capped. The game wasn't centered around that. Things aren't balanced for them, nor should they be.

And THIS is why people are afraid of what would happen should 1 vs 1 arenas be created. Massive complaints about game balancing for something that was just an afterthought added for a little fun because people asked.

Someone who's posting with a closed mind need not lecture me about empathy. Before listening to others, you'd already decided what is and isn't cheating, who is and isn't such a 'cheater', and you've even decided my degree of empathy for me, how sweet.

Well, I'm sorry if I can't get upset for you because you got beat down by someone who had an advantage over you, but you know what? I don't get upset when I lose either.
Yes, I'll make a stray comment of how I think drawing out battles pointlessly through things like trapping an area and waiting for the enemy team to step on it is foolish, or using run buff/debuffs and mending to survive indefinitely, even if you can't kill anybody or revive your allies. Those are mild annoyances, but that's about it. And after encountering them, I learn to deal with them appropriately.
If you were struck by a car, sick, injured, some other malady of the body, mind, or soul, I could empathize.
But you walked into a place intended for pointless fun, not serious competition, and when others who treated it as a place for serious competition, who prepared themselves appropriately, you lost sight of what it was in the first place.

I told you all that need be said:
There's nothing you can do about it, the game wasn't built for it, it's just there as a fun alternative to bashing monsters with PvE characters for a while. And if it matters that much to you, you can take heart in that the people who you dislike so much won't stay level 10 forever.

Take a step back and look at it objectively. I never said I approve of what they do to gain their advantage, but neither do I disapprove.
I gave an explanation of why the arena battles are already slanted and unbalanced, a reminder that they offer no penalty or gain whether you win or lose, and ended my post with a positive note reminding that each person doing it won't be around forever because they'll eventually level up and out of the arena.
If you're unprepared to handle somebody with a neutral stance, such that you have to take their comments as of a hostile nature, then there's no point in creating such a thread.

While empathy might be an important trait, if you can't see beyond the colours of black and white, you're certainly just as badly, if not moreso, off.

wheel · Jun 12, 2005, 10:20 AM // 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by CtrlAltDel

video?

30-45 minutes of video on a forum? are you kidding me?

If you would like me to show you, I charge 8k for a run, so you can pay that and see for yourself. And I charge at the Forge, not up front.

kthxbye

BrokenSymmetry · Jun 12, 2005, 10:56 AM // 10:56

The issue here is that for most players, the low-level arenas are their first experiences with PvP in Guild Wars. If these arenas are dominated by characters that have much better armor, weapons, or skills, then this will turn off many from trying any PvP later on.

Fighting in the low-level arenas like this may not be against the rules, but it certainly diminishes the experience for other "regular" players. So, if you care about other players enjoying the game then you should refrain from abusing the low-level arenas. If you don't care, OK, then just go ahead...

Sekkira · Jun 12, 2005, 11:55 AM // 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheel

30-45 minutes of video on a forum? are you kidding me?

If you would like me to show you, I charge 8k for a run, so you can pay that and see for yourself. And I charge at the Forge, not up front.

kthxbye

I actually wouldn't mind running through that myself a bit later on. Not sure whether to use my char that's got to Thunderhead peak or the one that I just got to Sanctum Cay with, but not many people with the level, skill and persistance are in Beacons Perch to try it out. I got halfway through once with henchies and got slaughtered off by a combination of a mob we could barely handle and a sandworm which tipped the scales.